So it looks like Clorox has been working on their Green Works cleaners for quite a few years.  Their new line joins their take-over for Burts Bees...

Here's an interesting audio piece from NPR.  Below is the summary:

Say the word "Clorox," and harsh products like bleach may come to mind. But the Oakland, Calif.-based company is making a big push into the market for eco-friendly cleaning supplies. Green Works, a line of "green" cleaning products, is the company's first new brand in decades.

A few small firms, such as Seventh Generation and Method, have been selling natural, biodegradable household cleaners for years. But those products cost more, and their loyal customers aren't typical consumers: They eat organic and shop at farmers markets or natural foods stores.

Clorox is marketing its new brand to mainstream consumers as the big retailers — like Wal-Mart, Target and supermarket chains — are bringing in more green products.

I've boycotted Burt's Bees (they make a great product) but I refuse to give my money to a company that still makes and sells bleach (clorox) So what they are going "green". Just because you add some green dye to a supposedly eco-friendly product, doesn't make you a truly green company. I rather buy my cleaning products from companies that are all around eco-friendly. Not half-a$$ed.

I commend Clorox's efforts to jump on the band wagon. But in my opinion, they will never be truly green until they cease production of bleach. Ick.

Thanks for starting this thread.

I work at a health food store and have been in contact w/ burt's bees directly on many occassions during this take over. Let's just say, I feel sorry for all the good earthy people that work there, they have a big hurdle to jump over.

I don't know where to fall on this one. Companies like Clorox have distribution and brand recognition that is really hard for any smaller company to match. By bringing these "greener" product lines under their name and distribution, many, many more consumers will have access to them and increase the chances that their greener options will overtake other, more harmful product lines that they offer.

I agree that a soup to nuts green company is preferable when possible, but broad distribution and usage of greener products can only help the industry as a whole.

I hear ya on the Burt's Bees comment though - must be tough for those employees to adjust to what I would assume is a VERY different culture.

Yeah...in a perfect world, companies would be all green.  And buying Green Works does of course support Clorox.  But it also does tell them that investing in green is a good deciscion.  Not to mention, big companies like Clorox, GM (not the thread on Bob Lutz), and Wal-Mart - while certainly not the greenest out there - have a lot of money and could potentially impact sustainable products going mainstream in a big way.

I completely agree with Deej on this one.  Yes, Clorox's core product is terrible, but they have incredible brand recognition.   Most consumers are afraid to change brands and many are afraid to spend their money on what my dad would call "that hippie stuff."   As much as I'd love everyone to convert to eco-friendly products tomorrow, it won't happen overnight.

For now, let's celebrate the fact that a huge polluter is willing to give the green approach a try - if their approach is successful, others are sure to follow.  Our favorite green brands flourish, and a greater number of consumers switch to eco-friendly products.  For it to work though, we have to acknowledge that baby steps today bring us closer to a revolution tomorrow.

I have to disagree with Treehugger.  When we start purchasing products from companies like Clorox that aren't going green because they care but because they have a good marketing strategy and want to make money, we are voting against the companies that really have green roots and care.  Not buying from Burts Bees but buying from Clorox makes no sense. Both companies are in it for the money, that's why Burts Bees sold! 

The idea that Clorox is a name brand that is trusted sounds funny. Let's trust a company that makes bleach, a toxic chemical.  Something is wrong with that. How about going with companies that were green before green was cool, Shaklee?  That's just to name one.

What about our health???? Everybody is only focusing on whether it works and that it is biodegradable - but it is still not good for your health just like the other cleaners!!!!!

I decided to research these product claims thoroughly and you can read what I discovered after this research and contacting clorox here: http://evolvingwellness.com/posts/72/maybe-natural-means-toxic-today-the-clorox-green-works-update/

Ah but see you're assuming that Clorox 'green' consumers will be the same people who bought products from companies that have green roots.

I think the good thing about Clorox green products is that they'll encourage the average consumer to buy some greener products, and actually think about what's in them.  It will make the average consumer more conscious.  I think the people who buy stuff like Seventh Generation will continue to buy it rather than switching to Clorox.  So overall I think it's a good thing.

Yikes, I sounded like Martha Stewart there for a second.

Evita,

Great article - it's so helpful that you really did your research. What piqued my curiosity was the ph analysis of the cleaners. Can you provide any comparisons to truly green cleaners? I ask because things with a ph of 2.1 are certainly alarming to me (and I know most cleaners aren't good having used the worst kinds and feeling headachey and light headed for a while afterwards), but I also know that there are many naturally occuring things with ph's both low and high.

Just curious - or if you can provide a link to a database of info that would be great too. Thanks!

dan

Hi Dan

I actually have not looked fully into the Seventh Generation, Ecover or Shaklee line of products myself as to their complete health effects yet.  I would love to do that in the near future.  I would imagine Shaklee would be a safe bet, as the company is owned by a couple whose kids were getting very sick off of commercial cleaners.  As for myself, at one point I was using the regular stuff out there and then just decided to make a change right to the other extreme and use baking soda and vinegar mostly and on occasion 1 product from Method as household cleaners. (I have not yet fully looked into all Method products). 

[ph of baking soda is around 8 and pH of household vinegar is around 3.5] Some may argue that even vinegar can be an irritant and naturally so but nowhere anywhere close to commercial cleaners, but it can be diluted down too for extremely sensitve people.  There are also good tea tree oil cleaners that are good antiseptics.

As for natural stuff having low pH, you are right, however what the products breakdown into in the body, and the concentration they are in also factors into the equation.  For me a lot of the basic info comes from my line of work.  You can find MSDS sheets on almost any chemical on http://www.sciencelab.com/msdsList.php (these sheets tell you credible info on a product)

I also came accross this site in the past http://householdproducts.nlm.nih.gov/index.htm

and it appears really good, but it is not complete and when you really read up carefully on some of the products a lot of info is supplied by the manufacturer which does not make it credible or not supplied at all. 

Ultimately it is not necessarily one product that will get us, but we are just getting too many chemicals from every angle today and as far as Clorox is concerned I just do not like anybody misleading others.

take care for now

Evita

That was my question too.  While i don't know the pH, I noticed this morning that my Seventh Generation cleaner has the same eye irritant caution.  Its man ingredient is hydrogen peroxide.  So I don't think the eye irritant or even pH factor is really a problem.  After all, lemon juice has a pH of 2.3, and cleaning products are designed to clean, not to get all over your skin, eyes, etc.

It would be good if Clorox were more forthcoming about the ingredients in their green products, but I don't think the pH or eye irritant warnings are reason to avoid them.

While I won't buy products from Clorox, I can only hope that the new green products are a "gateway" product for the masses.  They'll use them, and then they'll want to start getting into the "heavier" green cleaners.  You know, like vinegar, baking soda, lemon juice, etc.

I have to agree with Sommer, we would be voting against the green roots companies that have struggled, sacrificed and sweated to make their products and company name known.  And though it has been stated that loyal costomers of green rooted companies will remain so, maybe.  Or will it be another case of the "big corp." forcing the small guys to either sell out or fold.  unfortunately, that happens more and more.  yes, it's great that others are embracing "green" as a result of big companies, i just have to wander if there will be a high price to pay in the trade off.  : )
 

Exactly.  I mean, it's perfectly fine for you to boycott them.  I'm not going to be buying Clorox green products either.  But it will make the average joe schmoe a bit more aware of what's in his cleaning products, maybe get him to use some greener ones, and overall raise awareness.

Well I have to say it has been good to read a few of the opinions above so that I could mellow a little where Clorox Green Works is concerned, I guess they could have a good purpose for the general public and then hopefully entice other companies to try and make even better, greener and healthier products to join the newly popular market.

But what still bugs me, and this is after talking to a bunch of people at work, etc about this product is that when I ask people if they have heard of Green Works and what they think, the average person still associates it as being "green" with being ok for their health.  And it is that misconception that Clorox is not helping by telling people it is non-allergenic (and they state this in writing), and all natural, etc.  First of all how could anyone claim that anything today is non-allergenic, we have people out there allergic to chocolate never mind a cleaning product. And secondly I think that there just has to be a bigger push on everybody's part, companies and consumers to educate themselves and others on the fact that "green for the earth" does not necessarily mean "safe for our health".  Yes some of us may think this is common sense, but I continue to find out each day that many people do not know that.

And baking soda and vinegar do not have Caution-Irritant labels on them :)

Have you noticed that when companies make "green" household cleaning products, they usually have an "All-Purpose" Cleaner--and then half a dozen other ones, like "Toilet Bowl," "Glass and Surface" and "Bathroom"???   If they're going to change the ingredients, it's time to change the mindset too.

Yeehaw LizJane!  How about recycled packaging, concentrate products, not testing on animals, off setting your carbon emissions as a company, etc.  That's my issue with the companies coming out with products toting this word. It's a feel good word but it's a marketing ploy to get more money. If consumers were liking dog poop, companies would find away to package it, make it appealing and market it to the consumers.

I'm with the Shaklee products all the way!  Their Get Clean line is amazing, cost effective for consumers, has acheived the Green Seal and their Basic H2 cleaner is organic and super concentrated.  Their packaging is recyclable (even their dryer sheets are bio-degradable) they seem to be a fairly responsible company (bio bags, recylced or recyclable packaging, loads of info on how to live healthier and greener).  No company is perfect but I think they are constanlty progressing and I have yet to find another that comes close in cost and effectiveness as well as morality.

I got so tired of companies like Method and Clorox where unless you have time to do the research on them you run out and think you are one step closer to saving the world and long behold when you've freshly cleaned your abode you find out you've been duped once again.  I'll stick with my Shaklee anyday and I'd be hard pressed to even try anything new that arrives on the scene.

That's what's nice about Shaklee too.....I know I sound like a friggin sales person (which I am not, but my sister-in-law is)  They have this Basic H2 cleaner which is organic and Green Seal approved that has 1000 different uses...that's right I said 1000.  So even though they have other cleaning products (which are o.k too) you need only the Basic H2 to do EVERYTHING!!!

Trust me, I am not easily sold on anything green, especially when it comes to products that will directly influence my indoor pollution levels, it took my sister-in-law many presentations and samples to get me to be a believer....but after seeing what this product can do (I even use it as bubble bath seriously people!) I am HOOKED! 

Oh geez, I've gone on and on haven't I?  I AM passionate about it, that's for sure!

Edited by organicgal007 - Thu, 1 May 2008 14:24:02 UTC

Yeah, I am not keen on their other products either, I have done vast research on the ingredients and have received all of them.  The only ingredients they will not disclose is for their Basic H2 cleaner because it is patented.  However, that specific cleaner is Green Seal certified which means it has been rigerrously tested for chemical compounds and toxicity.  They got the certification to show the product's intergrity without having to release the ingredients.  If I was a company that had that product I would be careful who I release the ingredients to also.

Their other products I stay away from, and they do not claim them to be green anyway, I was talking specifically about their cleaning line, and even more specifically their Basic H2 cleaner.  Even if they are coining the term "organic" in a deceving manner, which doesn't matter anyways cause organic certifications mean nothing, the USDA is corrupt and was going to allow GMO products to be considered "certified organic", there is no testing involved with these products that receive certifications and no real follow up once a product has been labeled as such.  Like I said they are not a perfect company but they are progressive.  Method right from the get go claimed, marketed and labelled their cleaners as green, but are clearly not and never were.  Plus look at the vast variety of products they carry and how much packaging goes into it...are they really doing ANY good for the environment?  I'm sticking with Shaklee because they don't make false claims and a product that is featured on Oprah numerous times along with Time Magazine gets more respect from me than any with pretty packaging that make false claims from the beginning.

I just got an email today saying that the Sierra Club has partnered with the Clorox Green Works products.  Interesting.

Thoughts?

Interesting, very interesting.  Good move on their part, they will start gaining momentum with the grassroots community this way.  I still won't side with them until their bleach is only manufactured for it's only good use, disinfecting surgery areas. 

You seem to have a personal vendetta against Shaklee...who is Green Seal Certified.  I'm sorry but there in no other cleaning product right now that has that certification.  Whether or not they use "organic" in the wrong sense doesn't change the fact that have a certification behind their product.  It's simply my personal choice, and I feel the safest one at the time being.  Oprah was duped with A Million Little Pieces...I'm sure after featuring Shaklee 3 seperate times (and re-running those episodes a dozen times) and a feature article in Time Magazine, they would have already determined if they had made a mistake.

I'm totally not out to argue with you, nor am i trying to embarrass you. I just don't like companies who toss around the word organic like it's candy to a toddler. i don't have a problem if the product works and is truly green, i have a problem with them using the word organic on a non-"organic" product. i already stated that pretty clearly.

The big OP even pointed out several times they were Organic, making the mistake of confusing the two types of organic. I was eluding to the fact that even OP makes mistakes and helped further mislead the public about Basic H2 being "Organic". With the word Organic being such a huge buzzword these days, companies should take responsibilty to use it correctly. and it's not just Shaklee, it's a lot of companies that throw around the word organic. For newbies out there who don't know the difference, it's quite confusing. Companies, like Shaklee, need to stop confusing people.

if you go to this link, http://www.greenseal.org/findaproduct/cleaners.cfm  you can find a lot of companies that have green certified cleansers by the same company that certified Shaklee. It's not just Shaklee that has the only "green certified" cleaner. I  find it odd that in order to get the green seal a company must be transparent, but you yourself have said that Shaklee hides behind "patented info". That's not transparent. {scratches head}

other companies that make a great eco-product and don't have to dupe people by using the word organic:

Benefect

BioKleen

Ecover

Ecos (who is Green Star certified)

and a company that actually has a cleaner with certified organic ingredients: ONE Group

There are many certifiers out there. Here's some:

EcoLogo

LEED

GreenStar

Green Seal

Green Guard

National Green Pages

happy green cleaning

Still, they don't compare.  I realize that the word organic means different things.   I understand that you think they should be not using it, but after all they are a company and they do have marketing methods just as all the other companies you mentioned to.  I am mostly referring to ONE Shaklee product which is the Basic H2 cleaner.  All the other companies you mentioned have tons of products for all different areas of house cleaning, which really just means more packaging, which means more waste.  The ONE Group's products are great but way too expensive....how can lower income or even middle income people afford to buy all those products?  The Basic H2 cleaner does 1000 seperate things.  It is safe enough that you can ingest it and not have to worry about it.....and a super concentrated bottle that will make a ridiculous amount of laundry wash, bubble bath, shampoo, floor cleaner, window wash, all purpose cleaner, de-greaser you name it... costs around $11.00. 

So regardless of whether the word "organic" is used in the wrong context, it is still natural, economical (for everyone), effective and safe for use on all sufaces, pets, children and adults.  You cannot name a company that provides a product like that (hence the company's protection of the formula).

Individual testing by the Organic Association found chemical compounds in Ecover products also which you listed.

I agree with buyer beware, and I have used most if not all of the products you've listed and actually sold ONE Group products (Miessence)...the fact of the matter is...NONE of them come close.

I am glad Clorox is in the Green game. Where we shop there are few green alternatives, now we have one.

I think Shaklee is a scam. Yeah, right, you can "eat" their products. My neighbor keeps getting me to try their stuff. Their body care items have chemicals in it, what makes you think their patened ingredients aren't chemicals? Since it's a secret, no one knows.

I order Biokleen online and love that company!

I think I'm going to end this right here.  My child had severe asthma...I tried everything...Method, Miessence, Biokleen, Nature Clean, Seveth Generation, Ecover....you name it I TRIED it.  So I resorted to vinegar and lemon  and slowly watched my furniture be eaten away (small price to pay for my child's well being).  I now use the Shaklee Basic H2 for EVERYTHING in my home, and have no problems.  No you're not supposed to eat it....but if you're child accidentally got into it (as my friend's daughter did...and drank some of it) you would thank GOD that it can be ingested and cause no harm.

As for saying Shaklee Jumped on the "green" bandwagon with their cleaners, well you are sadly mistaken.  Their first biodegradable cleaner was released in 1960...so you should actually be thanking them for setting the precendence to all the other brands you are naming.

I have NO problem with any Green cleaner people choose, I was simply stating my preference and sharing my story.  A 16oz bottle of Basic H2 makes 48 Gallons of all purpose cleaner for under $12.00, I'm sorry I just have not found anything that the

I said they are the only GREEN SEAL certified cleaner out of all the household cleaners that you are mentioning today.  Yes, there are other certification or seals out there but Green Seal usually only certifies industrial cleaners as they need to be the most effective.  The Basic H2 is certified as it can be used industrially as well.  It is a very well respected certification to obtain and takes a long time to acheive.

You can hate Shaklee all you want, but I think before you start bashing things left and right you should do more research on what the foundation of things represent.  I don't necessarily like Shaklee as a whole company either, but I find they have mastered a product over the past 50 years that is unsurpassed, and I feel they will fall in line with the rest of their products as well. 

As for Eathmama Kylie....you are happy that a company (Clorox) that produces one of the most harmful and deadly chemicals on the planet has brought you a new green clean option but Shaklee is a scam?  Hmmmm?

Anyway no need to counteract again....we get you DONT like Shaklee.   I do and I was sharing is all!

oops. see above.

Wow, I think you've taken this a little far.  I am not a Shaklee rep, I just use the product.  I don't "rip" apart any companies, I was just saying none are perfect by far.  Just as you have your opinion, I have my own.  You are the one doing the ripping.  The swaering and name calling is awesome too!

I'm sorry if you think my friends kid is stupid, but it was a true story, I again am not a Shaklee rep and have never heard that story.  I hope you never have to go through that and be the "stupid mom"

I believe your comments are a little outrageous and uneducated.  If you can't handle a little debate without calling people stupid and taking it to a personal level you should probably stay away from  forums period.  Everyone has their choice in product and company, this just happened to be mine and you just keep going on about it.  I have done all my research trust me, and I know about organic certification, I work for a premier organic food service in Manitoba and own my own company.

It doesn't matter anyway, you've taken this too far.  They should just close the subject down already.

Beyond the good Clorox v. bad Clorox / good Shaklee v. bad Shaklee debates, I do think you all bring up a lot of good points.  There is a huge void to be filled in terms of green certification.  There are quite a few good starts (USDA organic, Green Seal, etc) but in the end, what we need is one ubiquitous labeling system with strict standards and a good system of accountability. 

As "green" does become more mainstream, there will of course be issues of greenwashing and misrepresentation.  Case and point is the suit the Dr. Bronner's filed recently all about the use of the word "organic." 

But on an optimistic note, I hope at the end of the day what we take away is that more and more people are getting into green and manufacturers are picking up on that.  We as consumers do have quite a bit of power to vote with our dollars and to show what we feel is important.

I just saw over on Treehugger that a representative from the Sierra Club spoke up in defense of their position.

Check it out: http://www.treehugger.com/files/2008/05/green-works-sierra-club-answers.php

"Some have called our endorsement greenwashing. But the bottom line is that the Green Works products are environmentally safe, made from corn- or coconut-based cleaning agents, essential lemon oils, and other natural ingredients; they contain no toxic chemicals, phosphorus, or bleach, and are hypo-allergenic. They do not use aerosol and did not involve animal testing.

And they're affordable and available to mainstream America."

How can an endorsement be greenwashing?  That's just silly.

I think it would be good if the Sierra Club also endorsed some smaller green cleaners (i.e. Seventh Generation, Biokleen, etc.), but I don't see anything wrong with them endorsing the Clorox green line.  It will help encourage more big companies to make green products.

With all this debate going on I went out the other day and bought the Green Works Toilet Bowl Cleaner and Bathroom Cleaner.  They were aroung $3.25 each at Albertson's (Grocery Store).  My 9 year old son and I cleaned up our 3 bathrooms on Mother's Day as part of the great day for Mom - they worked just fine ... actually better in that there were no harsh fumes or weird feelings in your skin as you used them.  (Stins - I will post reviews as well :-)

I jumped in on this forum just to hopefully give a slightly different angle on things.  Yes - I have BioKleen and Method and others in my home... but almost none of my neighbors do.  Most folks out there have no clue as to even the concept of what a "green" cleaner is.  If they have lemon oil furniture polish they think they are saving the planet.  Anything we can do to spread the knowledge and awarene